Combining my homebrewed card game and board game

[josta59]

My newest game development project is taking my Quik Frik card game and Quik Frik board game rules and mashing them together. The goal is to make a solo board game that feels like an RPG, using a hexmap that allows for single-character movement and combat.

For those of you who saw my card game a couple of months ago, I'm using the same cards. Now you'll be able to see the characters on a map board. Less imagination, more pictures!



I'm using one of the map boards from the old Firepower board game, since it's one of the few games I've ever seen, maybe the only one, with a hexmap that is made for man-to-man combat. I've drawn my Hero and Enemy cards. In this playtest, PFC Shi Jiang of the People's Liberation Army of China will be exploring the dark dimension, according to the situation card I drew. There's a mech next to him (defense card), but since he doesn't know how to operate it, it will only provide cover while he's near it. So it won't do him much good in this board game like it would in the card game, unless I keep him close to it.

Hiding in the shadows of the dark dimension will be a mercenary named Gero MacEachern.

Next step is to create some counters and place them on opposite ends of the board. Then I'll start seeing how well these rules will work.

[josta59]

I placed counters corresponding to the cards I drew. I started them off without line of sight to each other. PFC Jiang is in the same hex with the Actium II battle mech, but he doesn't know how to drive it.



Since Jiang is in the dark dimension, the Enemies win initiative every turn until one of them is disrupted. So Gero the mercenary moves 6 hexes toward Jiang. In the card game, he would attack right away, but on the map board, he still has no LoS. So Jiang will move until he's in sight.



I have a problem here. If this were a miniatures game, I would put him next to the wall so he's in cover. On this map board, I could move him to hex N5 so he has LoS, but he'd have no cover there. Or I could put him in hex O5, most of which is inside a building. There should be a way to put him in cover while having LoS. I'll take a look at the Firepower rules that came with this map and see how they handled this.

[josta59]

The Firepower rules go into much detail about cover, but, as far as I can tell, they never address this very basic situation of coming around a corner and using the wall as cover as you attack an enemy. How disappointing. Maybe this kind of thing is why we so rarely see hex-based games at this scale.

Lucky Luke is our Firepower expert. So Luke, if you come across this post, I'd love any guidance you can offer.

I think the easiest way to handle this is to create a counter that makes it clear what's happening. I expect I'll use this counter a lot. Check it out:

image posting

[luckyluke]

Apr 4, 2022 8:31:43 GMT -5 josta59 said:

The Firepower rules go into much detail about cover, but, as far as I can tell, they never address this very basic situation of coming around a corner and using the wall as cover as you attack an enemy. How disappointing. Maybe this kind of thing is why we so rarely see hex-based games at this scale.

Lucky Luke is our Firepower expert. So Luke, if you come across this post, I'd love any guidance you can offer.

I think the easiest way to handle this is to create a counter that makes it clear what's happening. I expect I'll use this counter a lot. Check it out:

image posting

Hi Scott, how could I refuse to help you?
in Firepower you can use obstacles to have partial or full coverage.
Those counters with arrows are used to indicate which side of the obstacle the soldier is on and which direction he is therefore protected from enemy fire.
In the BASIC Rules there is a "to-hit" modifier and the soldier is less easy to hit.
In the Advanced Rules there is no "to-hit" modifier but there is a table where, based on the stance of the soldier and the height of the obstacle, some parts of the body are covered by enemy fire.
Hope this helps....

[josta59]

Apr 5, 2022 23:55:03 GMT -5 luckyluke said:

Hi Scott, how could I refuse to help you?
in Firepower you can use obstacles to have partial or full coverage.
Those counters with arrows are used to indicate which side of the obstacle the soldier is on and which direction he is therefore protected from enemy fire.
In the BASIC Rules there is a "to-hit" modifier and the soldier is less easy to hit.
In the Advanced Rules there is no "to-hit" modifier but there is a table where, based on the stance of the soldier and the height of the obstacle, some parts of the body are covered by enemy fire.
Hope this helps....[/quote

Thanks, Luke! What I don't understand is how a character can enter hex O5 to take advantage of the cover there and still have LoS to hex Q6. It doesn't seem possible in Firepower. So I felt like I had to make a different kind of counter that allows him to both be in cover and have LoS.

[josta59]

Ok, now it's time to show you how combat works in Quik Frik. This applies to miniatures games as well as board games, and somewhat to the card game but not as much.

When Jiang moved to the corner and popped his head around (made clear by my new blue counter), he became subject to opportunity fire by Gero. Gero gets that opportunity fire on a 50/50 chance, and he does get it, so he fires first. I roll a 5 for his attack, which is modified by -2 because Jiang is in hard cover. Gero moved during this turn, so he doesn't receive a bonus for standing still--we consider him to still be on the move when he sees Jiang around the corner (they were moving simultaneously during this turn). So Jiang receives 5 - 2 = 3 friktion points (FPs), indicated by a little box with a 3. You can also use a die and turn the 3 side up, whether you're playing a board game, miniatures game, or card game.



Three FPs isn't enough to throw Jiang off his game, so he returns fire. I roll 4 for his attack. No modifiers apply, so Gero receives 4 FPs. Characters are ok unless they receive 5 or more FPs. So Gero's ok too. Either Jiang missed or Gero is a badass. Quik Frik doesn't provide those details, which might bother some players, but I like this system.

Both sides have taken all the actions they can for this turn, so I remove their FPs. There's no rallying to be done this turn.

The last thing to do for this turn is check if a new card is to be drawn. I roll a 3, which gets me nothing. So that ends turn 1.

So far so good!

[josta59]

Time for turn 2! Again, the Enemies always have initiative until one of them is disrupted. Gero is out in the open. I haven't created an AI for Enemy movements. I'll just have him move forward so he can have some face-to-face time with PFC Jiang. I can remove the "In cover, Has LoS" counter now because Jiang obviously has no cover from Gero at this distance. Note that opportunity fire doesn't apply now because there was LoS between them in the previous turn.

Gero then attacks. I roll a 5, and there are no modifiers that apply. This gives Jiang 5 FPs, which is enough to disrupt him. 



That's all the Enemy side can do this turn. So Jiang makes his move. I roll a 4 for him again. This time he gets a +1 modifier for not moving, but also a -2 modifier for being disrupted. That's a total of 3 FPs for Gero, which isn't enough to hurt him.

Next I remove the FPs, but I leave the disrupted marker. Time to see if Jiang will rally right away. He can bounce right back on a roll of 6. But it's a 2, so no such luck. He will remain disrupted going into turn 3.

Finally, it's time to see if I can draw another card. I roll a 5, which means I can draw a new Hero card! I draw a civilian, a marine mammal trainer named Kyou Nishimura. Not sure how he ended up in the dark dimension, but here he is. In the board game version, it doesn't matter where I put his card. I give him a counter on the left side of the board, back by the battle mech. No, he can't drive it either.



Kyou is already in sight of Gero, but the mech provides him with some hard cover since they're in the same hex. This is similar to the card game, where newly drawn characters enter the battle right away but can be in cover.

[Whiterook]

Apr 6, 2022 8:17:14 GMT -5 josta59 said:

Apr 5, 2022 23:55:03 GMT -5 luckyluke said:

Hi Scott, how could I refuse to help you?
in Firepower you can use obstacles to have partial or full coverage.
Those counters with arrows are used to indicate which side of the obstacle the soldier is on and which direction he is therefore protected from enemy fire.
In the BASIC Rules there is a "to-hit" modifier and the soldier is less easy to hit.
In the Advanced Rules there is no "to-hit" modifier but there is a table where, based on the stance of the soldier and the height of the obstacle, some parts of the body are covered by enemy fire.
Hope this helps....[/quote

Thanks, Luke! What I don't understand is how a character can enter hex O5 to take advantage of the cover there and still have LoS to hex Q6. It doesn't seem possible in Firepower. So I felt like I had to make a different kind of counter that allows him to both be in cover and have LoS.

So here’s a couple things and my two cents worth! 

1. In Lock ‘N Load Tactical, when you are entering a hex with two terrain designations, you can choose which terrain state you want to be in by paying the cost of the terrain you choose, thereby gaining the cover (or not) of that hex. So in this case, if you paid the cost of entering the woods in O5, you could theoretically be in cover at the edge of the woods. But still see out and around the corner of the building (looks that way to me, anyway).

2. In Advanced Squad Leader, there’s some mechanic I’ve seen (but I’ve never used it because it’s not present in the Starter Kits, which is what I play), where you can move around obstacles within a hex at the periphery. It has a term but I can’t recall what that is. So theoretically, you could move within that tiny bluish area outside the building and woods in O5, basically peeking around the corner of the building. If you used something like that however, you should have a modifier of some sort for th enemy, where they can try and pop you, but at a sever -drm for lack of a clear shot.

And as I think of it, perhaps you could look at it from the perspective of a soldier in a house, where you can shoot out a window, but the enemy has to make a Spotting die roll… in this case, denote that the soldier is in the corner of the building woods with a special marker indicating that, like “Low Profile”.

[josta59]

Apr 6, 2022 21:55:05 GMT -5 Whiterook said:

So in this case, if you paid the cost of entering the woods in O5, you could theoretically be in cover at the edge of the woods. But still see out and around the corner of the building (looks that way to me, anyway).

Oh, that's not woods. Just a messy alley, I think. I was like, whaaaat? LOL. Probably intended to slow movement but not provide cover.

Apr 6, 2022 21:55:05 GMT -5 Whiterook said:

2. In Advanced Squad Leader, there’s some mechanic I’ve seen (but I’ve never used it because it’s not present in the Starter Kits, which is what I play), where you can move around obstacles within a hex at the periphery. It has a term but I can’t recall what that is. So theoretically, you could move within that tiny bluish area outside the building and woods in O5, basically peeking around the corner of the building. If you used something like that however, you should have a modifier of some sort for th enemy, where they can try and pop you, but at a sever -drm for lack of a clear shot.

Interesting. Not sure how that would work here. I feel like I'm basically doing that with my new counter, though.

Apr 6, 2022 21:55:05 GMT -5 Whiterook said:

And as I think of it, perhaps you could look at it from the perspective of a soldier in a house, where you can shoot out a window, but the enemy has to make a Spotting die roll… in this case, denote that the soldier is in the corner of the building woods with a special marker indicating that, like “Low Profile”.

That's an idea. I like the simplicity of just having a -2 DRM when your target is in cover, though.

Thanks for your thoughts!!

[josta59]

I'm updating the rules as I conduct this playtest, so I'm not just playing a game. It's a true playtest.

Time for turn 3. Gero continues his up-close-and-personal attack on PFC Jiang (wouldn't make sense to have him stop and attack Kyou instead, and he can finish Jiang in this turn since Jiang is disrupted).



I roll 5 for Gero's attack--uh-oh. He gets +1 for not moving this time. It only takes 5 to make a difference, so Jiang is out of the fight already.

Gero can't move this turn since he just used the "not moving" bonus. So the Enemies can't do anything else this turn.

Kyou activates. My rules state that all characters should be assumed to be carrying at least a handgun, which wasn't stipulated in the card game but was needed for the board game since we're working with distances in a more concrete way. Kyou fires at Gero from his cover position. I roll a 1, yargh. Kyou gets +1 for not moving. Gero is 5 hexes away, which is close enough to avoid a distance penalty. Gero therefore receives 1 + 1 = 2 friktion points, not nearly enough to do anything. That's a miss for sure. Is this Kyou's first time firing a gun, maybe?

Luckily for Kyou, he'll be in cover no matter how close Gero gets and no matter what angle he approaches from. Kyou can keep moving around behind the Actium II. Gero can't get cover from the mech, which is a little unrealistic, but I don't mind it. It just means Kyou is menacing enough with his gun that Gero isn't able to get super close.

Can I draw another card? I roll a 4, which means no new card. That's it for turn 3.

[josta59]

Turn 4: I move Gero into cover where he can attack Kyou.



I roll a 5 for his attack. It's modified by -2 since Kyou is in hard cover, so Kyou gets 3 friktion points.

Kyou returns fire. I roll a 2. He gets +1 for not moving and -2 for target in hard cover, resulting in 1 friktion point for Gero.

No harm done. Those points are removed, and I roll to see if I can draw another card. I roll another 4, so no.

Not the most exciting turn!

[luckyluke]

Apr 6, 2022 8:17:14 GMT -5 josta59 said:

Apr 5, 2022 23:55:03 GMT -5 luckyluke said:

Hi Scott, how could I refuse to help you?
in Firepower you can use obstacles to have partial or full coverage.
Those counters with arrows are used to indicate which side of the obstacle the soldier is on and which direction he is therefore protected from enemy fire.
In the BASIC Rules there is a "to-hit" modifier and the soldier is less easy to hit.
In the Advanced Rules there is no "to-hit" modifier but there is a table where, based on the stance of the soldier and the height of the obstacle, some parts of the body are covered by enemy fire.
Hope this helps....[/quote

Thanks, Luke! What I don't understand is how a character can enter hex O5 to take advantage of the cover there and still have LoS to hex Q6. It doesn't seem possible in Firepower. So I felt like I had to make a different kind of counter that allows him to both be in cover and have LoS.

Good job Scott,you have done the same design process of Sniper! a SPI title re-published by TSR.
In Sniper! soldiers are Always in cover but they can 'expose' themselves to be able to fire at enemy soldiers moving in their field of view. At the start of turn every player rolls a die to see how many soldiers can put 'alerted'( but exposed as they are watching over/around the obstacle in their hex opposed to be using the obstacle as full cover) and so ready to fire on enemy soldiers moving. Players can put on alert a Soldier by giving him that action when Active.

Go ahead with your project!!!!

Luca

[josta59]

Apr 8, 2022 9:57:05 GMT -5 luckyluke said:

Good job Scott,you have done the same design process of Sniper! a SPI title re-published by TSR.
In Sniper! soldiers are Always in cover but they can 'expose' themselves to be able to fire at enemy soldiers moving in their field of view. At the start of turn every player rolls a die to see how many soldiers can put 'alerted'( but exposed as they are watching over/around the obstacle in their hex opposed to be using the obstacle as full cover) and so ready to fire on enemy soldiers moving. Players can put on alert a Soldier by giving him that action when Active.

Go ahead with your project!!!!

Luca

That's great to know, thanks! I didn't realize until now that Sniper! is a hex-and-counter game that uses a similar scale as Firepower, with each counter representing one person. One of the very few I've seen!

[josta59]

Ok, y'all, I'm going on vacation tomorrow and will be gone for a week, so I'm going to wrap up this thread now. But I'm happy to answer any question you might have. Happy gaming!